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I work at a public administration with an obligation to keep its software and systems #accessible for its civil servants, who like me might be disabled, as well as for citizens who use its systems from the outside.

Recently, #Firefox stopped working with my screen reader, after it was updated to version 115. After some investigation, requiring the aid of a coworker and far more knowledge about computers and #accessibility than should be expected from a civil service end user, I worked out what was happening. Can you guess?

Someone had the brilliant idea to set, as group policy, the following Firefox directive: accessibility.forced_disabled: 1.

Yes, that does what you think it does. It disallows accessibility providers such as screen readers to connect to Firefox and use the APIs. Who thought this was a good idea and why?

Jamie Teh reshared this.

in reply to Preston Maness ☭

Plausible, but still an awful idea. Anyway, by the time you have something that pwned the box enough to pretend to be a screen reader to Firefox you kinda have bigger problems.
in reply to modulux

Or possibly outdated performance information.

The first link that came up in search was a Reddit thread about setting that significantly reducing the resources Firefox uses. But that was from 3 years ago and another thread from last year says it seems a lot better in v113.

reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/…

reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/…

in reply to Curtis Wilcox

Sure, of course the tradeoff is slightly better performance for most people, 0 performance for me. I wouldn't complain so much if they had set it on the default profile they install, but doing it through group policy means a user can't edit it.
in reply to modulux

maybe they were trying to block Add-on that *could* be used to exfiltrate data?
in reply to Tom

It is possible, but my point stands: if someone has local control of the box enough to present to Firefox as an accessibility provider, the box is effectively pwned in every way that matters. If you can launch an a11y provider you can keylog, or take screenshots, etc.
in reply to modulux

The computer was updated *to* Firefox 115, not *from* 115?

I'm assuming these managed computers are using the Extended Support Release (ESR) versions but the first release of ESR 115 was July 2023. The previous ESR version was 102 and it hasn't received any security updates since August 2023.

The latest ESR version is 128 released in July 2024. It's standard for the previous ESR version to continue getting security updates for a few months after the current one is released.

in reply to Curtis Wilcox

Correct, it was updated to 115, and yes, it's an ESR release. The previous one was absolutely ancient, I want to say 68? Something like that.
in reply to modulux

Urgh. But also, thanks for giving me a data point (as someone on the Mozilla accessibility team) to help argue that making it possible to set this preference in group policy is a terrible idea and shouldn't be allowed. I suspect it's not a battle I can win, but I will try.
in reply to Jamie Teh

Yes, it's kind of bullshit that it's allowed to make the product inaccessible as a policy matter. Best of luck.
in reply to Jamie Teh

What does that option actually do? As in, what is the use case for disallowing accessibility?
in reply to Quentin

1. There is a theoretical security factor in that there can be clients other than assistive technology products that use accessibility APIs to gather information for purposes other than accessibility. It's no worse than something taking screen shots and running them through OCR or the like, of course, but I guess the data is more readily usable. But if you've got such a client running on the system, it can already do far worse things.
2. Building and maintaining the accessibility tree means extra work for the system, so that means there is at least some unavoidable performance impact. However, that only occurs if an accessibility client is actually querying the browser. Some non-AT Windows features do use the accessibility tree - e.g. suggested actions, snap layouts - but those features just aren't going to work properly if accessibility is disabled anyway.
IMO, neither of these factors at all justify the ability to disable this in group policy. I'm also a little frustrated with folks on Reddit, etc. suggesting disabling accessibility as a first course of action when performance problems are encountered, as it robs us of valuable diagnostic information from those users.
@modulux

modulux reshared this.

in reply to Jamie Teh

for security, if it is a big issue, could Firefox setup a whitelist of known accessibility programs & processes to auto allow? The same list could also work for performance, though I guess it might be annoying for less well known accessibility programs & how do you vet or add them? I remember Android had a similar issue at one point, but can't recall what ended up happening there
in reply to Quentin

I don't believe it is actually a big issue, but a few folks make a big issue out of it anyway. As you say, it's risky because we might block a legitimate use case. Also, it's surprisingly difficult to reliably detect accessibility clients. We do have code for it and we do block some clients, but I wouldn't want to rely on it for an "allow list", where the consequences of failure are legitimate clients getting blocked. @modulux
in reply to Jamie Teh

Yep that was the most obvious (note not necessarily best, just first) idea.
in reply to modulux

This also supports my theory about people editing group policies. You give them a list of options to allow/disallow and they disallow most if not all for no other reason than they can, or they are scared they will leave something open and get blamed later on. Though why this option is even a thing is another question.
in reply to modulux

Obviously someone despises accessability and disabled individuals in general so they think that they have the rite to discriminate!
This entry was edited (2 weeks ago)
in reply to Stephanie Appleby

I'm a bit more willing to give benefit of the doubt--I suspect ignorance rather than malice--but the effects are pretty bad all the same.

I might also add I issued a ticket on the user support system, and after a couple of days I only got confirmation that my diagnosis is correct, but no fix so far.