For me Christmas taste is definitely mulled wine, gingerbreads (especially alsatian and German ones), and apple with cynnamon. Oh, and candy canes of course, and chocolate. #MushroomFM
One really cool NVDA feature that I'm absolutely loving is the thing it does where if I run scoop update * or another command that gives me a fuckton of console output, it'll just lock up and freeze, often continuing to read terminal messages while I'm focused on the desktop, and sometimes even crash if I'm unlucky. I'm sure an insane amount of development time went into this, so kudos! Loving it!
To be clear, I don't begrudge NV Access this too hard. I still donate to them and realize how hard making a free and open source Windows screen reader is. But this has happened to me at least 10 times this week, so I'm annoyed.
@talon Jamy did try I think. That's part of the reason we have enhanced UIA event processing. I'm unsure if they could realistically fix it without completely changing its architecture at this point, because it probably is related to queues being flooded. That said, does it still haappen if you go to advanced settings and set speak new text in terminals via UIA, with console suport set to UIA and enhanced event processing enabled
@talon We do. I genuinely make sure to switch away from the terminal whenever building NVDA because if I don't it's pretty much guaranteed to make the running instance lock up. Unfortunately we aren't given the time to devote to these issues
Für blinde Folgende: Ich nutze jetzt ungefähr 1 Stunde lang Waterfox und kann bisher mit NVDA unter Win 11 keine Probleme feststellen. Webseiten kann ich lesen, Menü und zwischen Tabs navigieren, in den Settings war ich auch schon. Sieht bisher gut aus. Aber natürlich kann es sein, dass ich trotzdem noch Probleme entdecke. Aber angesichts aktueller Firefoxentwicklungen mag ich das.
Ich habe gerade mal die Mac-Version installiert und bin sehr angetan. Es gibt lediglich ein Sprachproblem, für das ich gleich mal ein Issue erstellt habe: github.com/BrowserWorks/waterf…
What happened? When running Waterfox on the Mac with VoiceOver, and selecting an UI language other than English in Settings, prompts still remain in English. To reproduce: Install WaterFox on the M...
@marcozehe Hab's nicht gelesen. Aber meiner war erst Englisch. Dann hab ich die Sprache in den Einstellungen auf Deutsch erstellt, dann war er sofort auch auf Deutsch.
Ja, das kann ich auch machen, dann schaltet sich die Oberfläche auch auf deutsch um. Aber VoiceOver bekommt das nicht mit und nutzt weiter eine englische Stimme, auch für Dinge wie "Taste" oder "Kontrollkästchen". Das liegt an MacOS, Waterfox teilt dem Betriebssystem nicht mit, dass es all diese Sprachen wirklich an Bord hat. Das sind ja alles interne Webseiten, die da angezeigt werden, und das ist abgekoppelt von der Basisgeschichte im Betriebssystem.
Today's #FreeSoftwareAdvent appreciation is for some of the Free Software languages that bring me both joy and income: Python & Golang
I've used Python at $DAYJOB since version 2.3 (it got woefully stuck at 2.4 for WAAAAY too long, and finally switched to 3.x some time in the last 2–3 years) and it simplified so many automation tasks there. I've used dozens of programming languages in my life for various tasks, and the hard part is rarely *writing* the code, but rather *reading* the code. And I find it a LOT easier to come back and read old Python code than just about any other language.
Meanwhile, Golang saved my bacon on a short-term contracting project where TB of (simple) CSV files needed to be processed, cross-referenced. Being able to spin up a pool of multithreading Go processes, have built in locking and hash-map structures, and operate on raw input buffers of bytes shaved a 3-day manual process down to about an hour involving running a single command. I find it pretty readable too, feeling a bit like C while ditching some of the most cumbersome aspects.
I've been here since the beginning, but have been enjoying birthday breakfast with my family! You guys sound great! Not to rush you off the air, but I am looking forward to hosting my first countdown hours EVER by myself! #MushroomFM
Totally agreed. And everytime #MushroomFM blows up, which is every year at this time, I keep wondering where the new Tweesecake is at, hopefully with functioning filters and mutes. Good on them for doing their thing, but I want nothing to do with it, so therefore, it truly is spam to me. And we need a way to block it on a popular client, if only for ourselves.
В России заблокировали приложение для слепых Be My Eyes
Все, что оно делало — помогало незрячим ориентироваться в пространстве.
В нем можно было связываться с волонтерами через видеосвязь или просить ИИ описывать происходящее вокруг — видеозвонки внутри сервиса как раз и могли стать причиной блокировки.
Официально в реестр оно пока не внесено, но в Be My Eyes подтвердили, что доступ из России ограничен hi-tech.mail.ru/news/139605-v-…
Подтверждаю, сейчас стон и вой стоит в слепецком сообществе по этому поводу. Собственно, предположение одно: если ты оператор связи (а BeMyEyes позволяет контактировать с волонтёрами), то нужно регистрироваться в каком-то российском реестре (сорри, я не в РФ, не знаю точно, как это называется). Потому и заблочили.
So viel zu temporärer Beschilderung: Anscheinend haben wir nach dem #38c3 nicht alle Schilder wieder entfernt. Die Wand ist sogar präzise rund herum neu gestrichen worden. 😅
Just helped someone on Be My Eyes, he was walking from his house to a shop about 10 minutes away.
Helped him navigate the streets and cross the road and so on. Luckily he lived in the UK so I knew what I was seeing 😅
He was wearing Meta’s AI glasses, which help him a lot but don’t currently describe things like lamp posts/scaffolding etc, which was where I was needed.
He made the call from the glasses also, and it was great that I could see what he could see also.
One of my favourite things is helping people on Be My Eyes 😍
Does GPT Pro give you unmetered gpt-5.2-pro access, and is it useable by API or only on the web? Honestly, there are some months where $200 is actually less than my API costs, so subscribing during heavy usage months would be nice, and during low usage months I could use pay as you go because my cost might be only like $10 a month or something.
@bill I wish it was connected to the API like that, but sadly they're like, completely separate products. I ted to use it on the web (even for Codex) because as far as I know, the API does not give you web searchh access and capability, which to me is a huge drawback, enough to not go using it if I have to build the web fetcher myself.
@bill oh that's interesting! I'll have to look into that new one then. Could be worth it. I think the $200 is web only, unlimited to chat in pro mode (or at least, I haven't seen usage restrictions at all on web search / conversations.) So it could be worthwhile if your token use ondemand for the pro models exceed that amount, perhaps, but the API per-cost option is more flexible with letting you use it in projects and such.
On Dec 27th at 3PM Eastern, one week from today, REAPER Made Easy's end of year wrap up/live listening party will be happening. This is where we hang out on a live stream and listen to a bunch of the productions people have done with REAPER and OSARA throughout the year. If you've got something you'd like to share, we're all ears! Send it in here: dropbox.com/request/mB2KhxVunz…
Anything you've made this year, anywhere in the world, in any language, with any amount of experience is welcome. The only limitations are one production per person so we can play as many of them as possible, and the majority of what we're listening to needs to have been made using REAPER/OSARA.
Feel free to post questions in this thread or via DM if there's anything you're not sure of. Boosts for reach appreciated.
Looking forward to hearing what everyone's been cookin'!
Apple products are designed for every student. Accessibility features like Magnifier on Mac, Accessibility Reader, Braille Access, VoiceOver, Sound & Name Re...
@menelion Great song. Wondering if this video is available though with audio description because it seems like there’s some cool stuff going on while everybody is jamming. Smiley face
@technocounselor Yes, sort of. I nearly wrote a Mastodon post about not having audio description, but then I remembered to switch tracks in YouTube. You find the Settings button, then search for Audio, it's a submenu, and there is English (Described).
Zwischen den Jahren ist es oft etwas ruhiger – genau dann lässt sich gut anfangen. IT-Sicherheit ist für mich kein Zustand, sondern ein Prozess über Jahre. Kein großer Umbruch, sondern viele kleine Schritte: Passwörter, E-Mail, Smartphone, Heimnetz, Backups. Wichtig ist nicht Perfektion, sondern überhaupt zu beginnen. 👇
🌞✨ Happy Sol Invictus! Today, we celebrate the "Unconquered Sun" and the return of light! While we enjoy this festive occasion, let’s also take a moment to appreciate the winter solstice, the longest night of the year in the Northern Hemisphere. It’s a time for reflection and renewal as we look forward to brighter days ahead! 🌌 #Solstice #solinvictus
Oh this bit from old Mr Long, Tall and Ugly made me laugh out loud. It’s a poorboy sanditch, Roland said. With lots of mayo, whatever that is. I’d want a sauce that didn’t look quite so much like come, myself, but may it do ya fine .’ #Bookstodon #StephenKing
Ich nutze nach wie vor Apple, und zwar inzwischen ausschließlich. Habe zwar einen Bluesky-Account, nutze ihn aber nicht. Und Sprachbedienung ist die falsche Seite, ich bediene mit Touchscreen oder Tastatur, nicht mit Spracheingabe. Was Blinde brauchen ist Sprachausgabe. Also das genaue Gegenteil.
Mě taky ne, ale po sérii zápalu průdušek nějak nemám odvahu vyjet v zimě ven. Možná bych to ale zkusit mohl. Po poradě s lékařem momentálně beru Broncho-Vaxom, selen, zinek, céčko, déčko. Prášky na esenciální třes a na tlak. Ten bych možná už mohl vyřadit, mám spíše nízký, než vysoký. A takhle nadopovaný bych snad vyjet mohl. 😁
@mireeek No ty jo tolik prášků 😱 Tak hlavně v klidu a neuspěchat to. Blbý je, že já mám jen silničku. Ono je u nás kolem nuly a mokro, tak mám strach, že to může být místy o hubu. Asi to bude chtít ještě koupit Gravel, nebo bike 😀 Jenže teď je v plánu nová silnička 😃😃
Zapomněl jsem na Alavis na klouby a na esoprex na nervy🤣. Ale polovina z toho jsou potravní doplňky. Déčko mám hodně dole a to asi bude příčina mých potíží s průduškami. Celý život si říkám, že jsem se měl narodit na jihu, (ale zase ne moc) to bych ho měl dostatek.
PCAPdroid is a privacy-friendly open source app which lets you track, analyze, and block the connections made by other apps on your device. It also allows
I found something interesting. If you visit the Balabolka page and scroll to “Download installers for Microsoft natural voices that work without Internet access”, you can download high-quality Microsoft voices for around 30 different languages. Voices are available even for Russian, Ukrainian, Arabic, Hebrew, Finnish, Dutch, European Portuguese, and more. Each language has its own separate installer, and since most languages include multiple voices, you can choose which ones to install during setup. These voices work very well with drivers like Natural Voice SAPI Adapter. Just a heads-up: the Balabolka page has no headings or landmarks, so you’ll need to manually search the page for “Download installers for Microsoft natural voices that work without Internet access.” cross-plus-a.com/balabolka.htm
When it comes to @Delta Chat (39c3) do you know it features 1 to 1 audio / video calls since v2.22? It has a very lightweight client side app built with web technologies and a minimalist server side component turn server called chatmail-turn.
I am wondering, am I alone running that turnserver behind a nat?
This turn server enumerates all the interfaces found on the system, identifies globally addressable addresses and creates an UDP listen socket on the default port. Relay connections for this scenar...
Dear #QT toolkit, recently I'm again looking into your #screenreader #a11y into #QML in particular. I'm trying to make one of my favorite apps @Mixxx DJ Software a bit more accessible. Last night I have managed to turn the menu with items such as 4 decks, Library, Effects and more into aria toolbar pattern in terms of keyboard navigation. It only consumes single tab stop when navigating through it and other buttons can be reached using the arrow keys. Of course there is much more to do and I've started a forum topic documenting my attempts.
Good luck. Initially I thought to post it with sarcasm, but now I'm absolutely serious. Good luck, if you manage to do something to QT accessibility which is dreadful, to be honest.
@André Polykanine On linux it's pretty decent after tweaking keyboard navigation as without accessibility specific tweaks even some of the #QML examples are not keyboard navigatable.
I am not yet sure I'm capable enough to make it into at least beta quality, however I'm trying to learn it.
One long-time Apple customer was left with no recourse after a bad gift card triggered a full account and device lock-out.
Paris Buttfield-Addison with an absolute horror story:
A major brick-and-mortar store sold an Apple Gift Card that Apple seemingly took offence to, and locked out my entire Apple ID, effectively bricking my devices and my iCloud Account, Apple Developer ID, and everything associated with it, and I have no recourse.
The full blog post is chilling. Buttfield-Addison only got his Apple account reinstated after blogging about his experience, and otherhigh-profileblogs re-shared his ordeal, which caught the attention of an actual human in Apple's executive relations team who restored his account a week later.
Buttfield-Addison is the latest public example of a company revoking access to a person's digital life, probably due to some automated decision, but where affected customers have no means or grounds to appeal. In reality, this happens all the time and most people's stories never hear the light of day. Even companies like Apple, which sell physical electronics for a living, hold too much power and control over their customers' digital lives in perpetuity, and customers generally don't have the means to fight back or hold the companies accountable when things go wrong.
It's also a warning to everyone — not just Apple customers and especially this time of year — that gift cards are prone to scams and are increasingly difficult to detect. If one bad gift card can result in nuking access to someone's account, then gift cards aren't worth the risk to begin with.
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I don't think I'll stop using Firefox anytime soon. Yes, their management are fucking idiots and it's annoying that I'll have to disable new AI features whenever they release them..
But the alternative is to use something Chromium-based, which would make Google's domination of web technology absolute - and Google is 100x more evil than Mozilla ever could be.
I hope this fucking bubble pops before Mozilla fucks up Firefox so badly that it becomes completely unusable
I have a lot of respect for #DeltaChat (@delta); By all accounts they provide a good looking client and a homogenize experience across platforms. Users absolutely don’t need to care about the underlying protocol!
However there is no way, shape or form in that IMAP+Submission is a more suitable stack for instant messaging than #XMPP.
Deltachat needs some kind of dumb protocol to exchange data. Currently it is imap, it may or may not be combined with other protocols in the future. It could be anything else. It can not be directly compared to xmpp as deltachat only needs imap to exchange data.
In other words, both are hard to compare because: * in xmpp, the magic happens server-side. * in deltachat, the magic happens client-side.
• The dumb protocol to exchange data can still be standardized. The actual data (for example what does an Emoji reaction or a delivery receipt looks like) needs to be standardized as well. 'Client side feature' or not. • How much data is stored on the server is just flavor. 10 years ago XMPP servers used to store a lot less data. A roster-less XMPP client is completely viable and would still be compatible with other XMPP clients.
@arcanechat every time I read about the idea over the years I was very much "really???" .. then I actually tried it. Honestly pretty impressed! Server-side, using protocols that dinosaurs like me are comfortable admining is a win, for my generation anyway :)
@arcanechat A good engineer can make everything work and end users don’t care either way.
However if we were to start from scratch and ignore the "everyone has an email address argument" which doesn’t really hold true anymore in times when 'Chat Relays" are the recommended transport and have a level headed debate about IMAP vs XMPP for instant messaging there is no way IMAP comes out on top.
> My question is rather: How can #XMPP market itself better to people who want to build instant messaging solutions.
my humble opinion: I would still pick #deltachat / chatmail core to build my client if I had to start from scratch today, with #xmpp I just have a protocol, with delta chat I don't actually need to use the #email protocol at all, only the core library that takes care of dealing with networking and #encryption while all I have to do is to create the UI
so if we could have such an "xmpp core" that would take care of the important stuff and encryption, then get it audited etc. then it will be much easier for people to use that to build their clients while knowing there is some level of security and common ground and compatibility between clients, I know some might say "having several implementations is better" but I think facts are talking by themselves, resources are scarce, it is better to unite forces
@menel that sounds like what I was proposing, now you need the xmpp community to embrace such approach,
don't get me wrong I would still not pick xmpp because there groups are centralized/depending on the server, too much dependency on the servers, with delta chat I already have the easy to use core and no dependency on server and soon even multiple servers can be used at the same time, your account is portable accross servers, xmpp is far behind there
@arcanechat XMPP needs no marketing, what we need is decent XMPP clients with E2EE guarantee. I’m on iOS, I haven’t tested them all but none came close to even Signal in terms of usability.
@Daniel Gultsch I'm sorry to bring this up again as it's somewhat personal, but I feel there is a bit of downside when it comes to #XMPP adoption among #screenReader users. The issue is that #conversations is the only #accessible xmpp app I know off. Ideally we'd appreciate at least single accessible XMPP based messenger per platform what @ArcaneChat @Delta Chat (39c3) have already.
well it depends on the context, I am Cuban, that Delta Chat used email was the whole point I started using it and contributing, besides cheaper data plan for national email, you see down there in the 3rd world on an unstable 2g connection at 1kb/s #email, asynchronity and offline-first comes on top of #xmpp which together with #Telegram really struggles to even get connected, in a fast hyperconnected 1st world this might be less relevant until some emergency times or in isolated areas
@arcanechat Might be a bit offtopic, but wanna add: here in Ukraine, during full scale war, we have relatively cheap unlimitted internet for which you pay ≈7$ in outskirt of small city and around ≈5$ in city itself. First one is GPON connection with 500mb cap, which is available during regular and long power outages. Second is default twisted pair with 100mb cap, but users can swap for same GPON with same tariff if building connected to optical network of that exact provider, otherwise choose another one which is already connected. Mobile providers also works during outages in 4G, but they are a bit expensive as for me, same 7$ once per 4 weeks for good enough tariff (true unlimitted just don't exist).
And Ukrainians not only have good and cheap internet access, we have really high quality services in mostly whole private sector. And all of that with the worst quality of life in Europe. We really good people, I promise. Please, #StandWithUkraine. It worth every your as little you could imagine your effort is. Stay safe and do cool things!
fair points, dear Daniel! Thanks for the praise as well, as well as the warranted skepticism regarding IMAP. It's a strange protocol to use for instant messaging, and it's not the strong point of what delta apps are today, arguably. Then again, internet and tech evolve via "shoehorning" something into another thing because "we can", for good or bad reasons 😂 are you making it to 39c3 btw?
I stopped using it. The people at Deltachat don't know why push implementation is necessary. They stubbornly refuse to support things like #UnifiedPush. Instead, they say each app should have its own background connection.
@Radasbona I am not sure it's dismissed all together. @Delta Chat (39c3) #chatmail relays already support google / apple push messaging and adding @UnifiedPush support might be just matter of finding a motivated developer. Still with imap idle in place the battery and network impact is minimal so it's not seen as very high priority thing. For example there is an email client called #fairEmail which does the same thing, keeping the imap idle connections open whenever it's able to and it's working fine. Within email app it's difficult if not impossible to add push messaging support unless you have control of the server side provider or you wish to trade your privacy.
If the kids who listened to Radiohead and Pulp and Oasis in the 90s grew up today, what would they be listening to?
I have absolutely no sense of the music landscape right now. Something happened somewhere after after Billie Eilish, that doesn't allow me to absorb any new music information. A kind of age-activated force field of some kind.
As a community, we often ask ourselves how to attract more users to #XMPP. Yet the real tragedy is that people would rather build something entirely new (loosely based on email or #ActivityPub) than consider XMPP. Need end-to-end encryption by default? If compatibility with existing XMPP clients is a secondary concern, you can implement it in your own solution while still benefiting from our two decades of experience in instant messaging.
@wolf480pl yes I think that is a huge part of the problem. It is very easy to completely underestimate the complexity of Instant Messaging. Sending a message from A to B seems like something every software developer can write before lunch and people don’t see how it can and will rapidly escalate from there.
But I don’t know how do communicate that to other people.
I consider this a failure on our part but I don’t really know what to do about it. Most arguments against #XMPP don’t hold if you’re building from scratch anyway:
• #Conversations_im looks very outdated: OK, but you are developing your own clients anyway.
• XMPP doesn’t have an SDK: Neither does your #ActivityPub or email stack
• OMEMO is insecure and I would prefer #MLS: Yes, let’s work on that together and you’ll still benefit from XMPP’s 100+ solved IM problems.
conversations outdated?? It's the client I like the most. It's the only mobile client that just works and has a greate UI. If people want something better they should be contributing...
IMHO, the point of both Delta and the new ActivityPub based chat (does it have a name yet?) is prevalence, at least in a certain part of society.
I remember, that Delta proponents said, that "you can reach everyone, who has an email address."
Now it is: "You can reach everyone, who has a fediverse account."
In the end, it is not that easy, e.g. because email users might not have autocrypt in their client, and it will take a while until there is #MLS in e.g. #mastodonEl.
The big plus of #DeltaChat is that the infrastructure is already there. Infrastructure is a big part of the problem. And obviously using mail for that is only for people born before 2000.
Second is branding: When people hear #XMPP they hear 20 years of failure of implementing robust solutions both server-side and client-side. People just don't know that after 20 years there now are server and client solutions really working.
@lazarus #XMPP is still a thriving ecosystem with lots of good FOSS developers doing interesting things.
XMPP is also used under the hood in tons of products needing instant messaging even if they are not advertised as XMPP clients, or do not federate. But look at #Matrix, only 25% of matrix servers federate.
Anyway, all three share a strong focus on protocols, but there is a big difference: chatmail.at does not expose protocols to client developers, just a Rust SDK.
Chatmail provides FOSS infrastructure for interoperable, secure, speedy and reliable end-to-end encrypted messaging. Check out clients as Arcane Chat, Bots or Delta Chat today!
It's funny how the thing you came up with where DeltaChat is different, is that it presents itself a Rust SDK rather than a protocol to client developers.
@daniel literally wrote about this "I don't like existing SDKs" topic above.
What remains is that before you created the SDK on top of a protocol that wasn't XMPP, it didn't exist either. Had you created the SDK on top of XMPP, it would still use a better protocol for the job and you would still have the SDK you just promoted.
@delta I understand there is a sunken cost situation now: You invested a lot of time and resources to build on top of a sub-optimal protocol. So it would be a wasted effort to migrate everything to XMPP and thus I'm not expecting you to admit XMPP would've been the wiser choice over IMAP+Submission (for C2S) and SMTP (for S2S).
@pixelschubsi It's probably true that abstractly, Delta could have used XMPP as an underlying protocol instead of email, or IRCv3 :) But the reality of how projects evolve is much more complex than just this protocol detail. In any case, things are how they are now. Delta could evolve to have XMPP transports, or some XMPP folks do a friendly fork of all Delta UIs and glue it to xmpp-backends. We'd be supportive of either, but can't do that work ourselves.
@delta @lazarus XMPP clients only partially can penetrate Imperial Firewall (Russia). Sometimes no message transfer, sometimes simple text messages can jump over Imperial Firewall. Audiomessages almost all need VPN ... Not very powerful system... Sorry. Its practical observed. I try communicate with russian dissidents.
not an expert here, but someone who despises matrix based on user experience.
It's not about the protocol itself. It's a bit about people hating dealing with xpath (me included). Json has one of the three: a value, an array or a dict.
If you want xmpp to be accepted, then you need to provide two things:
1. Sexy client, both web and mobile for user acceptance 2. Nice way to deal with payloads aka SDK for devs
Two more things: single binary deployment for server and e2e encrption
I saw someone on here recently mention the name, which I agree might be significant. People didn't flock to http, they got on the World Wide Web. I don't think 802.11 took off till it was called WiFi. There's Jabber - is that unusable for trademark or similar reasons?
some things that come to mind is * crypto with cross signing and proper device management, some clients also implement omemo 8 while the rest doesn't * more aggressive compliance levels, some clients support for example rich replies, which are nice to have, and stickers which do not have a fallback as far as I know * a better way to show clients on the xmpp.org website, I don't think that yhe average person will know about what core and IM is
I think it is a bit the same problem like with Linux: Too much freedom: Which distribution? (what is a distribution?) which desktop? In XMPP: Which client? Does it have OMEMO? Which server? How to register? Whatsapp: This app, Your number, give us all rights to fuck you up, okay, finished. Telegram more or less the same Signal also only one app. More freedom means more possibilites means more complicated and more confusion for first time users.
Q1.Is there a spec?Found this- xmpp.org/about/technology-over…. Why is this not included in w3c with the other OSI layer-7 application protocols? Q2. How do I use it? People using the tech (tool) don’t choose between OSI layer-7 application protocols, they choose tool that does a job/outcome they need done I.e. I want to send a “text message” to someone, whose contact details I have. I don’t want to be insulted or abused by strangers using or producers of tool. Q3. SDK? No. Code something.
XMPP is the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol, a set of open technologies for instant messaging, presence, multi-party chat, voice and video calls, collaboration, lightweight middleware, content syndication, and generalized routing of XML …
One of the biggest annoyances of xmpp for me, has been mismatched feature support between different servers. Best example is connecting with someone new and discovering we can't do encrypted chat.
))
Talon
in reply to Quin • • •x0
in reply to Talon • • •Sascha
in reply to Talon • • •Amir
in reply to Quin • • •James Scholes
in reply to Amir • • •