streamed yesterday: one-hour german #chaosradio @cccfr freiburg feature at @RDL with a deep-dive conversation about #deltachat origins, what it has and hasn't to do with e-mail, protection against server compromise, phone based compared to e-mail networking, how to conspire for baking cheese cakes, authoritarianism and sovereignty, protest and organization, how to arrange for shopping and checklists in chats ... and fun music :)
DeltaTouch 1.14.0 is out, bringing the message editing, deleting and bookmarking features that were recently released for the official #DeltaChat apps 🎉
#Signal took a huge bet that running on US big-tech toxic infrastructure is fine because its groundbreaking and industry-shaping cryptography is crafted to neutralize it and keep users safe.
But is it really feasible to live on toxic infrastructure in the longer run?
#deltachat rather takes a bet on the massive e-mail server network and interoperable protocols, and on #chatmail servers which enforce message encryption and metadata-minimization.
@delta I would be curious about some statistics and charts from nine.testrun.org, something like number of messages processed, amount of data sent or so.
Of course this is not the only chatmail server out there but it probably is the main one and stats might be a useful tool to help spread the word.
Maybe stats could even become part of the chatmail package?
There is no shortage of startups and enterprises animated by, or outright proclaiming, replacing e-mail as the de-facto open internet messaging standard. VC Investors are forever fascinated by funding such endeavours. #matrix #simplex #slack etc are examples.
#deltachat endorses e-mail but reconfigures and repurposes it to serve for interoperable instant messaging. The #chatmail server network relays end to end encrypted e-mail only, and servers are reduced to dumb store-and-forward relays.
Can we please stop with #XMPP's supposed "very" fragmentation? That's the kind of cheap shots that annoy me. Just like summoning the almighty gtalk that doomed us all.
First, is it that bad? (myeah? "It depends")
And second, you're bound to hit some level of fragmentation as long as your policy is to allow various independent implementations on the network. IMO the *only* reason you're not fragmented *yet* is because you provide a single implementation across platforms.
#XMPP also has some of these, the first example that comes to mind being #Snikket (snikket.org).
I am smitten with DeltaChat... DeltaChat has been making massive strides lately and I think you should consider using it as your full time secure messenger.
🔹 Sync deletion of messages and chats across devices 🔸 Page sized text editor for longer messages 🔹 Webxdc: Notifications (and more) 🔸 Improved integration into UT (ContentHub import/share)
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Release cycle completed. Please update so we can initiate the next release round with a long awaited feature ;) Generally delta apps are compatible to all currently released apps and because 15+ app stores come with all kinds of …
The downside of our project approach was that we often got experts being very dismissive on re-using email and #OpenPGP ... and there still is some opposition which often subsides when actually trying #deltachat and #chatmail, looking at security audits and our strong usable security focus.
There may also be surprising upsides. The UK "Online Safety Bill" which attacks end-to-end encryption integrity seems to not apply for ... e-mail. Because everyone knows, e-mail is unencrypted, right? :)
Last #deltachat releases introduced stable #p2p group membership not found in any other messenger. Members can add/remove peers also while being offline, and when everything comes online again, everyone has the same consistent membership view. We formalized and ran a simulation model using #TLA+ (invented by Leslie Lamport of vector clock fame):
@Cnoceda you can use your own email account or server as long as the provider allows you to use 3rd party email clients (ex. #outlook doesn't work, #protonmail and #tutanota doesn't allow it, etc)
About #ArcaneChat, yes you can import your profile from #DeltaChat to ArcaneChat and the other way around, they are fully compatible
@adbenitez is it posible To use both clients #ArcaneChat in #grapheneos and #deltachat in ios with the same email account? I've try but I get some issues with the encryption.
With #deltachat #chatmail and #webxdc developments we aim to instigate a new modern foundation for secure E-Mail and a resilient Web without platforms. We are building a kind of #minecraft system for modern decentralized messaging.
But who are we building it for?
For all who need reliable trustable means of modern private communication.
While our work needs hackers and experts it's not designed for them. @tante raises interesting and important related thoughts tante.cc/2025/03/03/who-is-fre…
For a while I have been arguing that maybe there are some issues with the whole “Open*” movements, their founding myths and ideologies (see for example my talk at Fluconf). This criticism comes from a place of love.
Finally convinced my non-techy family member's to move from Signal to Delta Chat messenger.
Setup was a piece of cake and we now have 4 x iOS devices, 3 x MacOS laptops, 2 x Windows laptops, 3 x Android devices, including 1 x GrapheneOS and 1 x LineageOS,, and two Linux Mint computers connected seamlessly as one Family Chat group.
Not one single byte of personal information required nor a single SIM card needed between us, though of course we all have them.
The security benefits and other bonuses provided by Delta are great but the key here was a de-centralised messenger that allows easy setup for family groups across multiple platforms.
Well, that's it! I am completely open source finally. No Google account. No Apple ID. No Microsoft, Meta, etc accounts.
The only organisation's who have my real email address are my bank, my government and my education providers.
Did you know that #deltachat literally shares cryptographic implementation code with #signal ? Both delta and signal use the ed25519-dalek crate ... Most messengers by now moved their cryptography to #rustlang . We did that in 2019. But in delta also all networking and message formats is implemented in Rust where other messengers (including signal) have a lot of platform specific code still.
Ich bin begeistert von #WebXDC und #DeltaChat. Es hat mich einen längeren Abend gekostet, aus webxdc.js und jspreadsheet.js eine funktionierende App zum Teilen einer Tabelle in @delta zu bauen. Mein Anteil: 50 Zeilen HTML mit etwas JavaScript codeberg.org/phormanns/shareta…
and now that you talk about young people, in several places people are not even allowed to get a SIM card at all until certain age, so apps like Signal that depend on phone numbers are a non-go, while I have seen several people using DeltaChat with their children, ex:
Onboarded my 12yo niece to @delta@chaos.social yesterday. They were looking for a solution to chat with her peer group split between iOS and Android, many of whom don't have sim cards in their devices (+ parents rightly resistant to use big social ap…
@adbenitez Well the thing I don't care for with #DeltaChat is that it uses email as its underlying transport mechanism. That, to me, just seems like the wrong approach for a chat client, for a number of reasons. If you can run your own email server it might be fine, but I have no desire to do that.
I really recommend you to give a try to #DeltaChat anonymous login without any phone number or any private data required, you can create as many accounts and add as many devices as you want, all work smoothly no encryption problems with multi-device etc and it has a better interface than #matrix on the level of #WhatsApp and #Telegram super user-friendly and painless to onboard family and friends
And you LITERALLY own your data and can browse it and search it offline
@spla +1 for Deltachat. Requires an auto-crypt-compatible email address. @Tutanota , would you please add #deltachat compatible auto-crypt goodness to your offerings?
PS: I have tuta, proton, and posteo.net email addresses (and thanks for the free service!). I pay for, and favor the posteo.net one the most. Why? Because of the auto-crypt support. (BTW: I am not paid in any way to endorse one over the other.)
#deltachat Basically, email is just a messenger standard. The normal user interface of email clients imitates classic letter writing. DeltaChat proves that you can just as easily use a modern messenger UI.
#deltachat is a minority messenger today and that's just fine for now. Changes often come from the precarious fringe which has to make ends meet, under hostile circumstances. Our approaches are aiming to provide working software that does its damn job. No unable to decrypt, no going for VC/Blockchain money, no bending the knee and no endorsing of corporate platforms. The #chatmail server network implements #interoperable #cryptography , does away with shady spam lists, catering for #Gmail etc
#XMPP enthusiasts out there: what would you say the ultimate Achilles heel of the XMPP ecosystem is, at present? Fragmentation of clients? What?
My sense is that it's this: when one goes to store an XMPP address in one's addressbook, there doesn't seem to be standard way to store an XMPP address. #Android doesn't have that as an allowable field, and #Thunderbird and #Nextcloud have an "Instant Messaging" field, where the type can be set to "XMPP". But are these two compatible with each other when trying to sync between them? Edit: Yes, but there's a catch: *the XMPP address must be prefixed with "xmpp:"*
So "user@foo.bar" is not an OK XMPP address, but "xmpp:user@foo.bar" is.
Then to make matters worse, now there's a wish to change the labeling of "XMPP Address" to "Chat ID": gultsch.social/@daniel/1140129…
It might be a long time before the address synchy-ness ever works again between Android <-> #Davx5 <-> Nextcloud <->Thunderbird
Note: Android allows a "Jabber" type for an IM address, where you *don't* prefix the address with "xmpp:".
(#DeltaChat gets to gloat hard here, as they have plain-old email addresses)
Interested to take a little tour through how #deltachat apps and the #rustlang core library are wired together?
@treefit and @WofWca provide a deep-dive into the history of apps migrating from a C-Foreign-Function-Interface to a #Rust based JSON-RPC mechanism, with entertaining horror stories like how an iOS release some years ago could delete profiles without the user intending it 😬
Foremost this is a quite technical post. Read our other blog posts if you want something more targeted at end users. If you have not yet looked at the Delta Chat source code, you might not know tha...
If you ever wanted to learn a bit about how #deltachat works internally and why we have two ways to communicate with our #rust core, then this is the introduction to read
Foremost this is a quite technical post. Read our other blog posts if you want something more targeted at end users. If you have not yet looked at the Delta Chat source code, you might not know tha...
- why chatmail servers? - how to setup a server with your child - (avoiding) spam filtering - metadata and guaranteed end to end encryption in #deltachat - #cryptographic #interoperability for email message routing
Thanks to attendees for the great energy even if was the last talk on the day and also for questions and conversations afterwards!
Delta Chat is since some years gaining usage by people forced to flee. Several of our contributors themselves migrated and others fear they might soon have to. Our technical designs and social approaches rest on a #RightToExit on virtually all levels. No walled gardens. No presidents.
It's true that #deltachat is a money-poor project compared to mainstream messengers ... But the question at hand in 2025 is: which messaging system will persevere when corporate platforms get corrupted and break?
Six times so far ... is how often important parts of #deltachat were independently #security audited and analyzed. Thanks to IncludeSecurity, Cure53, Applied Crypto Team at ETH Zuerich and Radical Open Security.
Last audit is from December 2024 covering @rpgp , the minimal #OpenPGP Rust library that is gaining traction with others projects as well. Shout-out to dignifiedquire and @hko for their excellent maintenance! For more info on Delta Chat related security audits: delta.chat/en/help#security-au…
What is Delta Chat? Delta Chat is a reliable, decentralized and secure messaging app, available for mobile and desktop platforms. Delta Chat feels like Whatsapp or Telegram but you can also use and...
Could I just attach @delta to my existing Postfix+Dovecot server and get the same features as the chatmail servers (aside from push notifications, I guess)? #Deltachat
What are chatmail servers and how to select one? Chatmail servers are optimized for messaging with Delta Chat to provide a privacy-preserving and speedy user experience, securely interoperable with...
Delta Chat is a decentralized and secure messenger app 💬 Reliable instant messaging with multi-profile and multi-device support ⚡️ Sign up to secure fast chatmail servers or use classic e-mail serv...
How can we evolve and deploy web apps without allowing developers or operators to become a “billionaire in the middle”? There are many ways to try to address this challenge and some involve the tec...
#Deltachat
